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Author Topic: Removing swirl chamber covers.  (Read 4971 times)

March 03, 2007, 12:48:31 pm

saurkraut

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Removing swirl chamber covers.
« on: March 03, 2007, 12:48:31 pm »
Any body ever remove the swirl chamber covers from a new head?  I have to remove them befor ceramic coating.

I tried tapping them out with a hammer and  brass punch and it only move a little.  i don't want to dork up a new head.

Would putting it a 150 F oven for an hour help?


'79 1.6TD RABBIT
'84 1.5TD RABBIT
'83 Diesel Westy
'86 Audi 5000 Turbo Quatro Wagon
92 Audi 100
'93 Eurovan
'82 Porsche 930

Reply #1March 03, 2007, 09:40:08 pm

935racer

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Removing swirl chamber covers.
« Reply #1 on: March 03, 2007, 09:40:08 pm »
Heating up definately helps, I heat them to 200 degres farenheit, use a blunt object through the injector port and and a hammer to punch them out. Don't ceramic coat those chambers eithers, leave them in, I havent had good luck with CC'ing them.

Reply #2March 04, 2007, 09:24:53 am

saurkraut

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Removing swirl chamber covers.
« Reply #2 on: March 04, 2007, 09:24:53 am »
Are you recomending that i don't coat the pre-chambers, covers, or what?

I've talked to Swain Tech about it and they seem confident:

http://www.vwdiesel.net/phpBB/viewtopic.php?p=45888&highlight=#45888

If so, what have you tried, and what failed?
'79 1.6TD RABBIT
'84 1.5TD RABBIT
'83 Diesel Westy
'86 Audi 5000 Turbo Quatro Wagon
92 Audi 100
'93 Eurovan
'82 Porsche 930

Reply #3March 04, 2007, 12:21:03 pm

tylernt

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Removing swirl chamber covers.
« Reply #3 on: March 04, 2007, 12:21:03 pm »
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Don't ceramic coat those chambers eithers, leave them in, I havent had good luck with CC'ing them.
I know that somebody saw no benefit to coating only the prechamber inserts, but I thought that coating the entire chamber would result in less heat loss to the coolant, and therefore easier cold starts and more efficiency. Is there a bad side to coating the prechambers?
'82 Diesel Rabbit, '88 Fox RIP, '88 Jetta (work in progress)

Reply #4March 04, 2007, 12:42:58 pm

RabbitJockey

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Removing swirl chamber covers.
« Reply #4 on: March 04, 2007, 12:42:58 pm »
i kind of doubt it would help cold starting
01 Jetta TDI 100% stock daily
81 Rabbit:TDI-M ported head, Frank06 cam, PD intake, hybrid T3 turbo, Renault intercooler, Syl20 11mm pump, light weight fw, and yellow California Clutch clutch kit

Reply #5March 04, 2007, 01:33:28 pm

tylernt

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Removing swirl chamber covers.
« Reply #5 on: March 04, 2007, 01:33:28 pm »
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i kind of doubt it would help cold starting
The theory is, it should keep more heat in the chamber as the piston nears TDC, instead of losing it into the aluminum walls of the chamber (aluminum is a good thermal conductor, which is why it is often used for computer CPU heat sinks and automotive radiators).

Not sure how dramatic the effect will be, though. If it's significant, I'm sure lots of folks would love to reduce the C/R of their TD's (so they can run more boost) without making it impossible to start in the winter. Us N/A guys would also love it if we never had to buy new glow plugs. ;)
'82 Diesel Rabbit, '88 Fox RIP, '88 Jetta (work in progress)

Reply #6March 04, 2007, 01:37:26 pm

saurkraut

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Removing swirl chamber covers.
« Reply #6 on: March 04, 2007, 01:37:26 pm »
The master plan is a ceramic coated 1.9 head on the 1.6 so hopfully I can run a slightly smaller radiator and get A big intercoller in front of it. I have an Isuzu NPR intercooler for the 1.6, but it won't clear the larger radiator. I have a new 1.9 head, just have to figure out what i'm going to run for valves, do some port clean up, and send it out for the cermic coating.
'79 1.6TD RABBIT
'84 1.5TD RABBIT
'83 Diesel Westy
'86 Audi 5000 Turbo Quatro Wagon
92 Audi 100
'93 Eurovan
'82 Porsche 930

Reply #7March 06, 2007, 06:02:57 pm

935racer

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Removing swirl chamber covers.
« Reply #7 on: March 06, 2007, 06:02:57 pm »
Ceramic coating the pre cups is not a great idea, it keeps heat out of the actual prechamber which slows down the combustion process.

Reply #8March 06, 2007, 06:11:46 pm

jtanguay

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Removing swirl chamber covers.
« Reply #8 on: March 06, 2007, 06:11:46 pm »
Quote from: "935racer"
Ceramic coating the pre cups is not a great idea, it keeps heat out of the actual prechamber which slows down the combustion process.


hmmm so what if you coated the prechamber??? why would ceramic coating the pre cups keep heat out of the actual prechamber??  very interesting!


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Reply #9March 06, 2007, 07:57:54 pm

935racer

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Removing swirl chamber covers.
« Reply #9 on: March 06, 2007, 07:57:54 pm »
Don't ceramic coat anything in there, trust me I tried all sorts of variations, you need that heat. The only thing I would reccomend ceramic coating in that area would be the intake and exhaust valves, the exhaust ports (only if the particular coater is set up for doing so) and piston tops.

And really I think the only one thats worth the time or money is the piston tops.

Reply #10March 06, 2007, 08:06:55 pm

tylernt

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Removing swirl chamber covers.
« Reply #10 on: March 06, 2007, 08:06:55 pm »
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Don't ceramic coat anything in there, trust me
Have you done the aluminum roof of the prechamber? That's what I want to try.
'82 Diesel Rabbit, '88 Fox RIP, '88 Jetta (work in progress)

Reply #11March 06, 2007, 10:37:17 pm

935racer

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Removing swirl chamber covers.
« Reply #11 on: March 06, 2007, 10:37:17 pm »
Yep, no noticeable gains found. What are you hoping to accomplish?

Reply #12March 06, 2007, 10:38:20 pm

tylernt

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Removing swirl chamber covers.
« Reply #12 on: March 06, 2007, 10:38:20 pm »
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Yep, no noticeable gains found. What are you hoping to accomplish?
I want easier cold starts and better MPG.
'82 Diesel Rabbit, '88 Fox RIP, '88 Jetta (work in progress)

Reply #13March 06, 2007, 10:41:15 pm

935racer

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Removing swirl chamber covers.
« Reply #13 on: March 06, 2007, 10:41:15 pm »
I had the exact opposite results, the lack of heat kept in the combustion area meant a colder less complete combustion= poorer starting and less power per amount of fuel injected = less mpg.

Reply #14March 06, 2007, 10:44:32 pm

tylernt

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Removing swirl chamber covers.
« Reply #14 on: March 06, 2007, 10:44:32 pm »
Well crap. So much for that idea.

Sorry you messed up a head trying it, but at least the rest of us benefited.  :(
'82 Diesel Rabbit, '88 Fox RIP, '88 Jetta (work in progress)

 

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